Community talk:GTA IV Gripes

Ok, I don't want to seem like an ass, but there are some redundant or just plain silly gripes, here...

"There is no Tank in this game, nor are there airplanes."

I do agree that airplanes kick ass, but in GTA4, you could only fly in a circle, because there's only one airport.

"The Hand-to-Hand Combat is not as good as in San Andreas."

Care to explain? It seems much better to me.

"You can't evade or outrun your wanted level in a helicopter"

Yes you can. Just not under certain circumstances.

"There aren't as many differnt clothing styles and options as there used to be, especially in San Andreas and theres very few "silly" options like mad hats and such"

This has already been said.

"Some missions are somewhat difficult to pass"

This is true of pretty much every game ever made.

"No matter how hard players try to get away from the police's radius, cops seem to spawn near the player's vehicle. Hiding is nearly impossible, even on secluded areas"

It is not 'nearly impossible' to shake a wanted level. I don't want to sound rude, but I can't think of a way not to... if you have trouble shaking wanted levels, you're either doing something to REALLY piss off the cops and get 4+ stars, or you need to play smarter. Even a 3 star level isn't TOO hard to get rid of if you know what you're doing.

"How the Voodoo was changed"

It was?

Talk to me, here.

ComradeJim270 22:56, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

People have these complaints because that is what they would prefer to have in the game. Sure, some are repetitive or unrealistic or just plain silly, but a lot of them are valid.
I would still prefer to have planes in the game, at the very least have a Skimmer. A second airport in Alderney would not be a silly idea, since the city/state is very wide, and helicopters aren't the best method of long-distance transport. Plus planes are fun. Perhaps they might come in the episodic content.
Then there's stuff that is opinion, such as hand-to-hand combat, mission difficulty, and character customisation. Perhaps it would be good for people to explain their comments a bit more - perhaps you could lead by example by putting some gripes of your own, and elaborating on them. Or discuss anything specific in the Forum. Good points though - Gboyers ^talk 03:41, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

I do agree that a lot of these are redundant and more just a "what's missing from San Andreas rant". Although San Andreas was an excellent game and there are a lot of things I miss, this game is not San Andreas. It's totally different in some ways, and I believe the devs are aiming to create a different experience. But I will say that there are some lame things in the game that don't make much sense, unless of course they plan to up sell on DLC. I removed an item that said you can't purchase anything from the internet, because we can obviously purchase ring tones and themes for the cell phone. He probably didn't get far enough in the game to realize it. Archangel717 05:30, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

Invalidation

All of these gripes can be completely invalidated:

1. There is no Tank in this game, nor are there airplanes. - Being able to easily pilot an airplane or drive (and shoot) a tank would be completely unrealistic.

2. There are only 3 unique Clothing stores in the game. - There's no need for more clothing stores. Liberty City is not a very massive city, so 4 total stores is enough.

3. There are no car mods or even simply choosing your paint color. - Car modifications are silly. Niko is not a gangster. As for choosing paint color, the Pay n Spray will select the color of the car you drive the most - so just idle overnight in the color car you want.

4. The parking glitch that makes your saved cars randomly disappear is not cool. - There is no evidence this is a glitch. People may steal your car, or police will commandeer it.

5. No store hold ups for easy cash or burglary missions. - This is a lie. You are able to hold up fast food restraunts and laundromats.

6. No "R3" Missions for anything other than the police cruiser. - Niko is not a taxi driver or a paramedic.

7. Given that a generic interior could be created, there's too few stores and the like to wander into compared to San Andreas (Cluckin' Bell outlets as just a facade with no way in). - There are plenty of interior rooms in the city.

8. The trees are invincible. - Trees are a lot stronger than cars.

9. Minor clothing items are removed during some cut scenes and missions. (glasses, hats) - Even if this is a bug or glitch, it can easily be dismissed as Niko taking them off before talking with the intended contact.

10. There are not enough "special" weapons like the chainsaw, the golf club, the pool cue, or the fire extinguisher like there were in GTA San Andreas. - Stupid. GTA IV is more realistic than SA.

11. Nor are there enough special vehicles like golf carts, lawn mowers, and bicycles. - The only thing I can agree on here is the bicycle, but this is still a stupid gripe.

12. No random games like the off track betting, Pogo the monkey or other arcade games save from Qub3d. - You can bowl, play darts, shoot pool, and many other activities.

13. You can't buy real estate like in San Andreas and Vice City. - Niko is not a gangster or an Italian crime lord, and there is already a business his cousin owns.

14. You can't Own Businesses. - See above.

15. You can't do home invasion like in San Andreas. - Niko is not a burglar.

16. No more taking over territory and defending it. - Niko is not in a gang and therefore has no 'territory' to take over or defend.

17. The Hand-to-Hand Combat is not as good as in San Andreas. - This is a lie. San Andreas' combat system involved button mashing with three variants. The new hand to hand combat allows disarming, stunning, and other combo moves.

18. No more acquiring skill as in San Andreas. - GTA is not an RPG. Go play World of Warcraft.

19. No more working out as in San Andreas. - See above, but I am very slightly disappointed with Niko's 'beer belly' look.

20. No more graffiti as in San Andreas. - Niko is not a gangster.

21. There are fewer cars in the game compared to San Andreas, and no fixed-wing aircraft available to the player - See above where applicable to special vehicles and airplanes.

22. Stealth kills as in San Andreas are no longer possible - Stealth is not a necessity in this game. Niko is not Sam Fisher.

23. There aren't as many different clothing styles and options as there used to be, especially in San Andreas and theres very few "silly" options like mad hats and such. - GTAIV is more realistic, and it is also not an RPG. The amount of clothing selectable is good enough.

24. How the Voodoo was changed - Silly. It was hardly changed at all.

25. Friends often call to do things at inconvenient times and are often on the other side of the city. - Taxi cabs will allow instant travelling.

26. Friends don't give you enough time to get to their location before they become impatient. - See above.

27. You can't evade or outrun your wanted level in a helicopter - Complete lie.

28. The camera angle is too low with no way to change it, I spend all my driving time holding UP, same as San Andreas - You can change the camera angle easily. I have had absolutely no problem with the angle.

29. There is no riot cheat!!!! No more chaos... - Silly.

30. Some missions are somewhat difficult to pass - This is an insignificant gripe. All games will have difficult parts.

31. Weapons are now seen on top of buildings, which is harder to find - See above.

32. Returning characters are completely absent, such as Claude Speed, El Burro, 8-Ball or even Toni Cipriani. There is little explanation why Rockstar Games did not return older chaacters from the past GTA eras - There are a few recurring themes, but GTA IV is more realistic and fairly different from other GTA's.

33. You can't operate trains like in GTA San Andreas - There is not only no need to operate a train, but you would require experience in order to do so efficiently.

34. The Hunter helicopter isn't here anymore - The Annihilator comes close enough.

35. When Niko steers the car in any direction, the steering wheel doesn't move at all, which left Rockstar Games no explanation to this problem - The steering wheel is nearly never seen in enough detail to waste time making it animated.

36. Airbags do not deploy on any vehicles when slammed head-on at high speeds - This is removed because having the airbag in a car activate every time you hit a bump on the curb would make the game tedious to play.

37. Ordering items on TV or at Tw@ does not work. You can't even order vehicles by calling them, even though it says so at AutoErotiCar.com - Lie. You can order vehicles from AutoErotiCar. Anything else, Niko does not require.

38. Well Stacked Pizza is missing - Insignificant, also see 32.

39. Military base is completely gone - A military base next to a crime-ridden city would be impractical.

40. ProLaps are seen at the Starlight District, but is no longer accessible. Didier Sachs may be seen at the same location, but is also inaccessible, including Binco. - Insignificant gripe.

41. You can't go underwater to see fishes, dolphins, turtles, even sharks - Insignificant.

42. You can't attach trailers in the back of your truck like in GTA San Andreas - There is no need to do this.

43. Tear Gas and Satchel Bomb was removed - These are insignificant, and you can still get bombs delivered to a target location.

44. Destruction of buildings isn't featured - Niko is not a terrorist.

45. No matter how hard players try to get away from the police's radius, cops seem to spawn near the player's vehicle. Hiding is nearly impossible, even on secluded areas - Complete lie. It is easy to flee from even a 5 star wanted level.

46. The humor is weak throughout the game. Pedestrian conversations are repetitive and are no where near as funny as they used to be. You can longer respond to random comments either positively or negatively. - Personal opinion. Insignificant.

47. You must keep your 'friends' happy to retain their special perks. It would have been preferable to unlock their abilities once and then be left to the player to decide whether they wish to continue the 'friendship'. - Would you be ready to assist your friend if he never did anything with you or even talked to you?

48. Some of the characters are downright painful and tedious. ie Brucie, Dwayne etc. - There are going to be annoying characters in every game.

49. Brucie's helicopter is useless. It would have been better if you could fly his helicopter yourself. - Personal opinion. Insignificant.

50. Street Gang-Banging and generally street gang-related missions have been dramatically reduced, means, no point in shooting other gang members. - There are no "other" gang members because Niko is not in a gang.

51. Only 9 street races available and difficult to access them through the phone system. - Not entirely true.

52. No special races that unlock special cars (like Destruction Derby) - See the other gripes about cars.

53. With so little to buy Money is worthless - You can buy weaponry, food, and taxi cab fares.

54. No parachute - Insignificant. There is no need for a parachute.

55. Ammo limits are really, really annoying. - Personal opinion. With 1500 pistol rounds, 1200 SMG rounds, 80 shotgun rounds, 600 assault rifle rounds, 50 sniper rounds, at least 5 RPG rounds, and at least 20 grenades available as limits, there is absolutely no need to complain.

56. When you store your favorite vehicles in the garage on any houses and then come back, the vehicles that you stored dissapeared! - You do not store vehicles in garages. You store them at the parking places in front of your safehouse.

PlasmaFox 11:51, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I don't see the purpose of your post here. People have posted a lot of things which they dislike about the game - such as aircraft. Of course a lot of it is personal opinion - that is exactly what this page is about. You can't statistically analyse a game and say it is perfect - no game is perfect, and everyone will react differently to it. Just saying "Insignificant" or "Personal opinion" or "Silly" is totally inappropriate, considering this is what people DO want in the game, you can't just say they're all wrong because you don't agree. Gboyers ^talk 11:58, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

How stupid are some of these gripes.

The fact Rockstar have explained most of their reasons for not adding some things to gta 4 like tanks when do you see police or criminals rolling through new york after one guy or blowing up police and civilians---never. when do you see the army chasing afetr one man in new york never. Niko isn't a spy,gangster,buisnessman. Niko isn't trained in paramedic abilities, piloting planes or firefighting. Niko can however be a taxi driver by ringing up his cousin as thats the only way he'd get payed for it because he'd have to be hired by a taxi company and do regular work hours which would get in the way of the story otherwise. The islands have differant names to gta 3's islands as its based on New York and New Jersey not Liberty city from Gta 3. Niko has more self respect than to be seen in stupid hats or clothes. Niko is a poor illegal immigrant not a gangster so why would he "pimp" his cars. Niko dosn't want to own a buisness or property as he isn't trying to take over liberty city he's trying to clear his and romans debt and make a lway for himself. The reason you don't see any recurring char is because there dead proof of this is seen on a wall as it says rip (chars name) on a wall along with date of deaths.(look it up in a secrets faq on gamefaqs then go and find it for yourself) The extra vechiles like bikes and golf carts are a fair complaint as i wouldn't mind them being in it but i really couldn't care less that there not in it. In gta 3 you couldn't actually play pogo the monkey you only heard about it on the radio. extra weapons wouldn't go amiss but only if they fitted golf clubs and pool cues would be fine. The hand to hand is alot better than other gtas which just involved you hammering a button to kill them. Stop being such a pussy all games have hard parts if you can't do it your just a bad gamer.

Jeez, maybe we should also create a Gripes about GTA IV Gripes article...question is, where does the griping end? Eganio^Talk 21:24, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Discussion of layout and style

I agree with Eganio, but I think it's an important outlet for readers/editors. Perhaps we should develop a system for people to "rebut" gripes, such as:

There is no Tank in this game, nor are there airplanes. --Theothersteve7

Tanks would be unrealistic, as the armed forces would not send a tank into New York City after a single man. Airplanes would also be unrealistic because air-travel around New York City is extremely restricted, plus there's really not enough area to need air-travel. --GuildKnight^Talk2me

Of course, we could set up an easy-to-use template for gripes and rebuttals... thoughts, anyone? --GuildKnight^Talk2me 05:19, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Great idea! This allows everything to be kept together for the sake of coherence. Maybe we should endeavor to somehow categorize within the article, e.g. Gripes about Vehicles in GTA IV, Gripes about Gameplay in GTA IV, etc...I dunno. It seems like it might be a little easier on the editing eyes to separate things, considering the sheer number of gripes, and allows editors to edit smaller sections at a time, thereby enabling them to find what they're looking for and edit it much more easily. What do you all think? Eganio^Talk 08:58, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

I updated my above sample with a new template. How about sections like; ==Gameplay== (things like the combat system, lack of "R3" missions), ==Vehicles== (things like no tanks, driving mechanics), ==In-game World== (things like building interiors, clothing options), ==Weapons== (things like no dual-wielding, no silly weapons), ==Story== (things like no returning characters, too short). --GuildKnight^Talk2me 21:18, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Nice! This will also give editors the opportunity to perhaps "pinpoint" what it is they take umbrage with, with everything being separated like this. For instance, someone may not like the gameplay in general, but enumerating every aspect they find disagreeable might take too long. With your format, they can go through the gripes under ==Gameplay== and see what aspects others have griped about, and how they can contribute, without feeling the need to list all their gripes in a long post. I like! :-D Eganio^Talk 22:14, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

I would also like to suggest we remove the attributions from the page. This will prevent users who are just attempting to fill the page with their name. I'll give it another day for feedback. If no one objects, I'll probably implement it tomorrow evening. --GuildKnight^Talk2me 00:29, 11 June 2008 (UTC)