View source for Talk:GTA Fan Fiction

{{ombox|text=This article is intended to be an '''explanation''' of fan fiction, NOT an exhaustive list or directory.

This means that we are happy to have some examples, but on the whole we want information rather than links.

However, you can create a page for your Fan Fiction over at [[gtm:|Grand Theft Mods]]}}


==Canon Fiction==
How can any unofficial fan-fiction be canonical? Surely if its made up by someone other than Rockstar, then it does not actually chronicle the events in the GTA series. If it was approved by Rockstar to be the true story of events then it could be counted as canonical, but that hasn't happened to any. [[User:Xenon|Xenon]] ([[Sysop|Admin]]) [[User talk:Xenon|talk]] 16:39, 9 April 2007 (BST)

:What us fan-fiction writers generally consider to be canon is something that doesn't contradict the storyline. As far as I can tell, I've never crossed that line aside from in [[GTA: TUS]], where the age of Carl Johnson is a bit out of tune. Although, as well, a nuclear bomb being detonated in the U.S. is unlikely for GTA, [[GTA: Deliverance]] could possibly take place hundreds of years in the future. So, I understand your point, but canon really just means that it doesn't contradict the main plot. [[User:Carl &quot;CJ&quot; Johnson|CJ]] 23:25, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

::I can add one thing in requirement of canonical fan-fiction. It's "being natural". For example(I'm not attacking CJ's novel, just criticizing weakly), how can Tommy and Carl are meeting in Vice City, 1986? CJ was stayed in Los Santos 1987. And never refered 'second, third return' in GTA:SA. Although they knew each other, I think Tommy and Carl should be an old enemy. Because they keep the valance, maybe. Anyway, fan-fiction have to solve a covered events perfectly, I think. --[[User:Mr.Korean|Mr.Korean]] 11:55, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Okay that makes more sense. I'd suggest you say "non-contradictory fiction" for something that could realistically happen in the GTA universe, without changing existing storylines or going against anything canon. But if you start changing anything, then it would have to be "contradictory fiction". Or similar. [[User:Gboyers|Gboyers]] <sup>[[User_talk:Gboyers|talk]]</sup> 17:02, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

== Massive vanity ==

Sorry, no offense to [[User:Carl "CJ" Johnson]], but this seems like one big vanity page for his fanfics. Having not read them I can't comment, but is it really notable on a factual encyclopedia?... [[User:C-d-rom|C-d-rom]] 17:51, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

:I agree, though not to cause offense to [[User:Carl "CJ" Johnson|Carl "CJ" Johnson]]. This wiki is mainly for covering ''actual'' events and aspects (vehicles, characters etc) of GTA games, so fan fiction doesn't really warrant its own article on here - although there is ''nothing'' wrong with mentioning/promoting your stories on your userpage or associated userpages. Again, no offense, but I seriously doubt that people would search a wiki about GTA for fan fiction. - [[User:Hardrock182|Hardrock182]] 18:04, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
::Totally agree, the wiki is for information on grand theft auto, not made up stuff. Now, I myself love to write a bit of fan fiction and love reading the ones about background characters and such but fan fiction should be uploaded to another site dedicated to fan fiction such as this: http://www.fanfiction.net/game/Grand_Theft_Auto/      --[[User:LuisFernandoLopez|LuisFernandoLopez]] 18:17, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

I agree to an extent. However, I can see how fan fiction ''could'' be relevant. If there was more of it, and it came from more people, then an article like this would be good. However in its current state, it would be best in another namespace, either under a specific user (that personally maintained a list of fan fiction, like a personal project) or as a forum topic. Perhaps this article could be about fan fiction in general (or something more general, such as being in a [[Canon]] article), with one or two examples - then a less-official non-encyclopedic full list could be kept elsewhere (eg the Forum)? [[User:Gboyers|Gboyers]] <sup>[[User_talk:Gboyers|talk]]</sup> 02:20, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

== Deletion ==
I vote yes. --[[User:DT-boy|DT-boy]] 09:32, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

I think we should keep the GTA Fan Fiction page on Grand Theft Wiki.  I mean, sure, it's a page that includes the URLs of fan fictions that Carl "CJ" Johnson is promoting, but it is still a wiki page... which means (we all know) that we have the right to edit.  I myself am a reader of fan fictions; they are fun to read and are like an HBO series for custom- made GTA episodes.  I am saying now that we should all use the GTA Fan Fiction page to both write about what a GTA fan fiction is all about, and, post our own links to other GTA Fan Fictions.  And after all, the fictions are '''GTA''' related... and isn't this website titled "Grand Theft Wiki"?  So I really don't see the problem with the page.  -[[User:Omega'sHand]]
:I agree. Although these episodes are not official stories, we need to save, read, study, recommend, comment and another act with them. There will be something valuable to GTA History Researchers, Unofficial GTA Storyteller like Carl "CJ" Johnson & others, GTA Fans and etc.
p.s. Omega'sHand, not Carl "CJ" Johnson but Carl "CJ" Johnson & others. There're another authors in that page! --[[User:Mr.Korean|Mr.Korean]] 07:02, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
::Oops, forgot "and others" when writing.  I'm just saying that leaving the GTA Fan Fiction page active on GTW would be good for two things.  One; good for the pleasure of reading, writing, and promoting GTA Fan Fictions.  And two; what if one of the people working at Rockstar Games (Dan Houser or another "hierarchy" at Rockstar Games) happens to get on GTW, read one or more of the fan fictions, and want to make one into a real sequel or prequel game to the GTA series?  It would make the Fiction's creator big money for writing the thing in the first place and it would be a motivation for more people to write/read/promote the fictions.  -[[User:Omega'sHand]]
:::I really agree and hope about second thing. I don't know if Rockstar will be read or use them. Privately, I think the elite (who superior in several fields) is underestimate the usual often. If Rockstar really want to make sequel/spin-off/other series, they need to open contest like a 'WORLDWIDE(we haven't to forget the fans of other countries!)' GTA Fan-Fiction contest. Of course, they need to be interest in other Fan-Fiction tellers from other countries. That's a impartial opportunity, isn't it? --[[User:Mr.Korean|Mr.Korean]] 03:29, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

==Really needs to be deleted==

This page REALLY needs to be deleted. Let users create a fan fiction page in their OWN namespace (eg [[User:Carl "CJ" Johnson/Fan Fiction]]. This after all is a factual encyclopedia. Plus peoples names are plasterd all over this page, which is against GTW policy. [[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]] 03:36, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

== Is there any other way to take place Deletion? ==

I agree little about deletion of GTA Fan Fiction page, but it'll be valuable from another viewpoint. Someone who has good suggestion about this problem, say it.

:I really doubt this should be deleted as this there are some GTA fans who like writing there own GTA plots and are creative about these GTA fiction.I like to write some GTA fan fiction my self and it would seem harsh to delete it.-[[User:BloodyGTA]]

:: How is it valuable from ANY viewpoint? This whole page is pretty much user speculation. This is a factual encyclopedia, having a whole page of speculation is not good. It seems that users want to plaster their names all over this page and create strange, weird stories that no one even reads. Seriously, this page, much like the [[GTA IV Deathmatch Kill Messages]], is seriously irrelevent and is not needed in the slightest. --[[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]] 03:46, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

:::I hate to sound rude here but how do you know that nobody reads these stories? Some of these may seem weird or strange but it is in outlet for some GTW members and they post this here so people can read  there stories on this page just like any other story writer.I mean I know this a wikipedia of some sort for the GTA series but it is good to be creative and write there own GTA storyline.Anyways were going to have to wait untill an Administrator or Manager meets up with this problem-[[User:BloodyGTA]]

::::I agree with BloodyGTA, and actually, many people read the Fictions.  And who said this wasn't a factual encyclopedia?  GTW has pages like the GTA Fanfic page to keep people occupied with the site, same goes to the voting polls and discussion pages like this one.  I think what should happen to solve this problem is to set up a voting poll for all of the GTA Wiki users to vote on this problem.  After a set date, the voting poll will be shut down and the winning choice will go in affect; the GTA Fanfic page will either be taken off for good or still be on GTA Wiki as an editable and readable page. -[[User:Omega'sHand]]

Omega'sHand, in response what you said in the "Deletion" section -- ''"And after all, the fictions are '''GTA''' related... and isn't this website titled "Grand Theft Wiki"?  So I really don't see the problem with the page."'' -- that is '''not''' a valid reason to keep this article, you also seem to suggest earlier in your post that just because this article was created, it is worth keeping (if I'm misunderstanding, fair enough). Incase it isn't obvious enough already, Grand Theft Wiki is essentially supposed to be an "online encyclopedia" which provides factual information on various aspects of the Grand Theft Auto games; characters, vehicles, weapons etc. There is absolutely no reason why we should have articles containing information that isn't ''directly'' related to the GTA games - especially fan fiction, which is non-canon, and therefore irrelevant in regards to this website's main objective. Also, why would people who want to read GTA fan fiction come to ''this'' website to find it? Wouldn't they just do a Google search for "GTA fan fiction"? or go to a website devoted to fan fiction, such as [http://www.fanfiction.net/ fanfiction.net]?. As Chimpso mentioned, if users want to promote their stories, they should do it via their own userpage and/or the [[Forum:Index|forums]]. Lastly, your claim that ''"GTW has pages like the GTA Fanfic page to keep people occupied with the site"'' is completely unfounded and false, if you look at the article's history you'll see that [[User:Carl "CJ" Johnson|Carl "CJ" Johnson]] created it, obviously in an effort to promote their own stories.- [[User:Hardrock182|Hardrock182]] 04:13, 11 August 2009 (UTC)'

:I've gotta agree with that. The reason CCJJ created this article was to make his fan fictions stand out. It is really a page which is focused on making a user famous (sorry if that choice of words was a bit serious). Anyway, anyone agree with deletion now?

::I see what Hardrock182 is saying and I am starting to lean on taking the page out, but I feel that we should still keep the page, but add major changes to it to meet requirements.  In other words, we should take out the links to other fanfics and keep the definition of a GTA Fan Fiction for the Encyclopedia's sake.  I know I'm leaning sides from what I was saying before in this discussion and what I'm explaining may sound irrelevant to the site, but just hear me out with this.  -[[User:Omega'sHand]]

:That sounds like a good ides. This page could not be a place where users advertise their stupid fan fictions, but a page that explains what fan fiction is. Anyone agree? --[[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]] 07:45, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

::I can see what you have in mind Omega'sHand, but even if we did that, the article would ''still'' be about fan fiction - the links to people's stories are merely part of the problem, removing them won't really accomplish anything. In regards to the fan fiction wiki mentioned below, that is probably the best solution. - [[User:Hardrock182|Hardrock182]] 00:38, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

==Solution==

I have a solution. I have created a Fan Fiction wiki called  [http://gtafanfiction.wikia.com/wiki/Grand_Theft_Auto_Fan_Fiction_Wiki GTA Fan Fiction Wiki]. I suggest we use that for now on. --[[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]] 09:40, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

:Good work, [[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]]. By the way, what we talk about in there? I think about that and I made a list of something needed.

1. The Definition of GTA Fan-Fiction(Essential)

2. History of GTA Fan-Fiction(Unimportant?)

3. Requirements of GTA Fan-Fiction(Essential)

4. The common opinions among the Fan-Fiction tellers(Essential?)

5. Other possible Roots(Essential?)

6. Real Accidents referenced in GTA(Unimportant?)

Are there any things need to add or delete? --[[User:Mr.Korean|Mr.Korean]] 15:23, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Well to tell you the truth, I coulden't really give a damn. I only created that wiki to shut all the yappers on this talkpage up. I have no intention of actually RUNNING it. Im willing to make [[User:Hardrock182]] the manager if he wants. Seeing as he has the experience. I don't belive im ready to actually RUN a wiki! --[[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]] 08:25, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

:This was a bright idea.Thanks [[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]].I haven't been concentrating on this more concerning on doing fan fiction on GTA and others.I would like to watch over this site with [[User:Hardrock182|Hardrock182]] (If he accepts) if that is not a problem with Chimpso.-[[User:BloodyGTA]]

::Sadly he did not accept, he said he was not ready to starst his own wiki and that he was just an editor. Thats ok though, I respect his decision. Im happy to give you the position of manager friend. Create an account on the site and I will promote you :) [[USer:Chimpso]].

Is this wiki still running? If so, link to it on this page. [[User:Gboyers|Gboyers]] <sup>[[User_talk:Gboyers|talk]]</sup> 17:02, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

== Question about Definition of GTA Fan-Fiction ==

I don't know how wide the definition of GTA Fan-Fiction. Anyone answer me about these examples and tell why you answered like that?

Example 1:The Story written with GTA characters and GTA cities, but somethings changed like a vague accident(Death of Victor Vance, little happening in "High Noon" mission from GTA:SA, etc.) by author.

Example 2:The Story written with GTA characters, but those stories not happen in GTA cities, but remade/other/own cities. (remade=fan expansion of GTA cities, other=cities from other games like a Stilwater in Saints Row series, own cities=just cities what made by fans)

Example 3:The Story written with GTA cities, but accidents are not related with GTA characters (If necessary, with GTA history). "Long Night Mod(frankly speaking, that's not a novel. It is treat zombie attack)" is correct example. And other accidents, like a stories of honest police officers, new characters and gangs or ordinary peoples are possible?

If he possible, I want to listen a opinion of [[User:Carl "CJ" Johnson|Carl "CJ" Johnson]]. He'll know about this because he written some GTA Fanfic, right?
(It's too bad that he never reply on my article in Guru Games HQ. Is he toss them?)--[[User:Mr.Korean|Mr.Korean]] 04:41, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

:I think anything deliberately set in a GTA location or using GTA characters should definitely be considered as GTA fan fiction. Even when it doesn't, but the writer has deliberately based their story on GTA-style storylines, and is writing it as if it were a GTA game, that would still count as GTA fan fiction if they wanted it to. As you say, there are many different formats that these stories could be, some completely different to anything in a real GTA game, which is fine. [[User:Gboyers|Gboyers]] <sup>[[User_talk:Gboyers|talk]]</sup> 17:02, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

== Decision ==

Fan Fiction definitely exists, so we should have an article explaining what it is. However, fan fiction should not be in the main namespace of this wiki, as it isn't official or canon. That said, users are free to put fan fiction in their [[User:Carl "CJ" Johnson/Grand Theft Auto: The Untold Stories/History|user space]], in the [[Forum]], in the [[:w:c:gtafanfiction:|GTA Fan Fiction Wikia]], or on an external website. This page should explain what Fan Fiction is, and link to some examples. [[User:Gboyers|Gboyers]] <sup>[[User_talk:Gboyers|talk]]</sup> 16:55, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

== The List of Fan Fiction =

I propose that we delete the list of GTA fan fiction, and instead just add a link to the GTA section of Fanfiction.net.  The list as it is now is too biased towards grand theft wiki users and the stories they've written.  It would be better if we could just link to the constantly updated GTA fanfiction.net page, so that not all the shown stories are by wiki users.[[User:Tornmuscle|Tornmuscle]] 21:03, January 7, 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. As there is now a link to the GTA section of fanfiction.net, it negates the need for a list of stories within the article itself - and generally makes it seem as though GTW users are simply using this article to promote themselves. I think that if the opening paragraph was extended slightly and there was some information about the different types of stories (i.e. canon, non-canon, crossovers, etc), then this article should be pretty much complete. - [[User:Hardrock182|Hardrock182]] 23:01, January 7, 2010 (UTC)

::I agree, this page is definetly being used by GTW users to promote themselves and make them stand out. Really, there is no need for this page. I think that links to fan fiction sites would be enough. My idea: Delete all the fan-fictions created by the users and replace them with links to fan fiction sites (not links to seperate fan fictions, but the sites). That would complete this article. That is my solution, and I doubt that any fan fiction would be canon, even if things weave into it that ''are'' canon. '''''[[User:Chimpso|Chimpso]]''''' 03:23, January 8, 2010 (UTC)

:Good point, although by "canon" fan fiction stories, I was meaning stories which use existing characters, locations etc. However, you ''are'' correct, even with actual characters and settings, the stories themselves - being mostly made-up events (with occasional references to "actual" events in GTA games) - could never be considered canonical. - [[User:Hardrock182|Hardrock182]] 12:36, January 8, 2010 (UTC)