User talk:Gboyers/archive8

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What's going on with {{Navbox}}?

All templates linked there (like {{Vehicles}}, {{Weapons}}, {{Broker neighborhoods}}) show up with messed up template links (the "v • d • e" links on the upper left corner), yet that template hadn't been changed for months (Did a wiki software change cause this?). This needs to be looked into ASAP. - ZS 04:53, 15 August 2011 (BST)

Looks better now. Saw the nifty revision UI too. Good work. - ZS 06:02, 15 August 2011 (BST)
It looks like {{Navbox}} will still show a "Error: No name provided" line if it's displayed together with other navigation boxes though (Infernus#See also). - ZS 06:17, 15 August 2011 (BST)

Thanks and question

Thanks for making me trusted. However, a random notice, the list of trusted users doesn't seem very trustworthy. If I go to , I only get a list of 5 people? I can't help but think there should be more people on that list. Amongst others, all the admins are missing from it. Not a huge thing and maybe it's just me but thought I'd ask you anyway. --Andreaz1 13:04, 17 August 2011 (BST)

Yeah, that explains everything. I had a look in the User Rights Log and couldn't understand why the list was missing people that seemingly should have been on it. Now I understand though, thanks! --Andreaz1 13:26, 17 August 2011 (BST)

Change Username

Hi Gboyers, can you change my username to Samsonius.--Mizu (talk) 00:07, 21 August 2011 (BST)

On second thought nevermind, sorry to bother you.--Mizu (talk) 21:21, 21 August 2011 (BST)
Okay, false alarm I didn't want to change it because of another user at Wikia has the same username, I am 100% sure I want it change my username into Salubri.--Mizu (talk) 07:20, 28 August 2011 (BST)


Hi Gboyers, I was wondering what kind of skin the Grand Theft Wiki has?--Mizu (talk) 00:46, 24 August 2011 (BST)


Earlier tonight, I made the catergory Category:LCPD, but when I added it to articles, only 1 of them showed up. Any way to fix this? Bacon777 11:48, 24 August 2011 (BST)

Image Problem

Hi Gboyers, do you know why the image type bmp. is illegal here?--Mizu (talk) 03:00, 27 August 2011 (BST)

I've been having problems with my laptop, every images I saved ends up a .BMP, and how do I convert it into PNG/JPG/SVG?--Mizu (talk) 03:02, 29 August 2011 (BST)
Thanks a bunch :),--Mizu (talk) 14:58, 29 August 2011 (BST)

The GTA Place Account

Hey GBoyers, My account on The GTA Place is MrLanceVanceDance.Also, feel free to talk to me via my talk page if theyou wish to discuss anything about the forum with me.Thanks.--MrLanceVanceDance 11:54, 27 August 2011 (BST)


Hey Gboyers, this sever you payed for, how much does it cost?--Mizu (talk) 04:38, 30 August 2011 (BST)

I see, just curious, knowing the money I was trying to create a Wiki just like this one.--Mizu (talk) 04:48, 30 August 2011 (BST)


Those accounts were created in order for me to contact you when I accidently change the skin of the Grand Theft Wiki in my preference.--Mizu (talk) 05:06, 30 August 2011 (BST)

Sorry about those accounts.--Mizu (talk) 05:36, 30 August 2011 (BST)


"In my opinion, their rules are rubbish and the staff are pretty awful", how are the rules of the GTA Wiki rubbish, we prefer to have a source for info that were not sure about, that makes sense, and the staff aren't awful at all. If you want a user like Greg then fine but I think you should do a little more research on him and why he was really blocked. The Tom 17:19, 30 August 2011 (BST)

The Tom

What is with him? Sticking his nose where it isn't wanted? I know we probably have a clash of personalities, but I can live with that, he scared someone's gonna bring him to task? Shouldn't be a moderator if that's his attitude, Gboyers thank you for your reply to me also, could you kindly tell The Tom to go and make love to himself and not put his nastiness where it's not wanted, him, Dan the Man 1983 and McJeff, they are like rats, I don't need them looking into me like I'm some sort of Ameba! It's internet bullying! Gregallz5

Sorry force of habit, been on their site too long, I got it from them, I thought that their website was this one with a different name, didn't know that they copied and pasted it, wow they were intelligent init?! Gregallz

What's their page and what's it all about and what's the beef between this one and the other one? Gregallz5

Could you kindly please tell The Tom that Maria Hickment and I share a flat with each other and have two lap tops so of course we're gonna have the same IP and not make me sound like someone with an altered ego! Gregallz5 22:46, 1 September 2011 (BST)

Yeah all I said was that I'm a book writer, I ghost wrote the last two Martina Cole books and the Keeping It Real book for Grace Dent's Diary of a Chav series, if it pleases or offends him, he'd just have to either A) get over it or B) not like that. Gregallz5 12:16, 2 September 2011 (BST)


Hey Gboyers. I probably should have introduced myself sooner, for obvious reasons... you probably know who I am, I'm a bureaucrat on the other GTAWikia. Talking to you and trying to come to some sort of understanding is something I've been meaning to do for a while but kept putting off because I know a lot of people here are angry at wikia and have a low opinion of the staff on my "imposter wiki".

First, much more so than when I started on that other wiki as an administrator, I understand and sympathize with your guys take on it. It's just that when your users make vandalism runs over on the other place, like User:Tommy-Vercetti did here it gets you into a fight mentality. I also think it's a little much to call all the staff over on the other place awful. WikisEditor was desysopped for the plagiarism and I've been strictly watching to make sure GTAWikia editors don't copy info from Grand Theft Wiki. as 4 the computance role u dnt have users over here whu writ liek this and get basic facts rong all tha tyme. I mean, I've seen you mention how much you hate that rule regularly, but we don't go around abusing it. In fact we've yet to block anyone for incompetence, it's just a safeguard against truly awful editors. Wikipedia itself sometimes bans editors due to competence, so it's not like it's a rule that we and only we have.

Anyway I came here today because of the way Gregallz5 has been causing trouble over here, thought I'd tell you the full story of what happened with him since he and Tom didn't. On the Gregallz5 account he got two warnings for incivility, then a three day block for calling someone a "stupid prick" in an edit summary. He immediately made a new account, GBTheWriter, and admitted it was him on its user page and "slagged off" the staff who blocked him, which I indefinitely blocked and extended the block on Gregallz5 to 2 weeks for block evasion. He then made a third account, TheRealLondonDeal doing the same thing he did on the second, which caused us to block Gregallz5 indefinitely. He made the Maria account, Tom asked for a checkuser from Wikia's staff and it came back positive, then it was blocked too.

So that's about it. You obviously don't have to agree with my opinions on running a wiki or my decision to edit the Wikia-hosted GTA Wiki, but I would ask you to please get my side on things before just writing me off as "awful". McJeff 21:27, 2 September 2011 (BST)


Hi Gboyers, I just thought I'd let you know that I've resigned as Bureaucrat of the GTA Wiki, I doubt you'll care too much but I thought I'd let you know just in case you needed to contact the GTA Wiki about something in the future. The Tom 23:57, 2 September 2011 (BST)

Couple things

First I made a page on GTA Wikia called GTA Wikia: Community split. I know you guys feel that the Wikia version is illegitimate and even illegal and so it's inadequate, but it's a long shot fairer than pretending nothing happened. I tried to represent your views as fairly and neutrally on that page as I could.

As for MrLanceVanceDance, he did leave two actual links to the Wikia website, on the talk pages of Bunnyjoke and Crescendospectredragon (the two recently desysopped users) apologizing for their alleged mistreatment and asking them to come over here. Bunnyjoke's debatable I suppose, the thought that C-dragon was mistreated is laughable since he never contributed and claimed it was because there was "nothing for him to do". However I disagree that not including a link makes what he did not spam, anyway. McJeff 20:12, 3 September 2011 (BST)

Left you a response on my talk page since probably multiple people are going to want to participate in that conversation and switching pages to follow a long conversation can get confusing. McJeff 05:07, 4 September 2011 (BST)

"Mizu101" is an impersonator

Hey man I'm sorry to trouble you with more drama but this is kind of important I think.

The user "Mizu101" on this wiki is impersonating a "Mizu101" who is still active on Wikia, and the culprit behind it is a user who's been in a nearly two-years-long ongoing dispute with me (it all started because I blocked him on Bully Wiki after I caught him anonymously vandalizing my userpage there). His primary username on Wikia last time I checked is 4th Hale, he's also The Quiet Man, Seth Tomasino, Old West, Goodfellas90, and probably a few others. I didn't go into further detail here because 4th Hale does this to amuse himself and I try to deny trolls attention, but if you need the details on the situation I can give them to you. I've also already informed the real Mizu101 on Wikia. Jeff (talk this way) / (stalk this way) 05:37, 4 September 2011 (BST)

I am not impersonating anyone, however since you brought up this trouble, I would like my username to be change.--Mizu (talk) 08:00, 4 September 2011 (BST)
Hello. I am Mizu101 from Wikia. As in, this one. Jeff contacted me on Wikia about this, as he has said. This 4th Hale (I'd prefer not to call him Mizu101) is a person who previously contacted a Wikia staff member in order to get my account on Wikia. After he was able to do this, he began changing a lot of things. When I contacted the same Wikia staff member, he apologized and said he made a big mistake and he gave me my account back after about 3 days. 4th Hale later admitted via e-mail that he had hacked my account. I later told the sysop at Bully Fanon Wiki about this. 4th Hale was globally blocked from Wikia for approximately a month, then somehow got unblocked (I don't know how).
Anyway, in our e-mail conversation, he said he really liked the username Mizu101. I just noticed yesterday that he had been using the username here and Wikipedia. I do have a problem with this. I do not care if he uses Mizu101 on other types of websites, but on wiki-based websites (such as this), people assume that a Mizu101 here is the same person as a Mizu101 on Wikia. And I would not like my reputation to be affected by 4th Hale. RealMizu101 14:33, 4 September 2011 (BST)
Also, based on this, I don't hate Wikia, I am not an Athiest, I am not 16, I don't own a PS3, I don't use Internet Explorer, my favorite game is not Bully (though I do like it), and if he does actually follow the Grand Theft Wiki Rules, he would not have missed number 5 which says "No sock-puppetry or user impersonation". RealMizu101 14:44, 4 September 2011 (BST)
And there's another person with the same username for goodness sake I am not impersonating anyone. as I said before since someone had just started this trouble and I am willing to have my username change.--Mizu (talk) 15:55, 4 September 2011 (BST)
You need to learn to read other people's messages before posting your own. I said "I do not care if he uses Mizu101 on other types of websites..." Yeah, there is a Twitter account Mizu101 and a YouTube account Mizu101, neither which are me, but they are not wiki-based websites. RealMizu101 16:11, 4 September 2011 (BST)
My last message was to McJeff.--Mizu (talk) 16:56, 4 September 2011 (BST)
That doesn't make my message irrelevant. RealMizu101 17:27, 4 September 2011 (BST)
Using Mizu's username may not necessarily be impersonation, but copying his avatar, signature, and even the "senior editor" banner he first posted on Bully Wiki a few years ago [1] is extremely bizarre. Of course, just about everything that 4th Hale has done over the last 2 years has been rather bizarre. Jeff (talk this way) / (stalk this way) 17:45, 4 September 2011 (BST)
1. He doesn't own that avatar, anyone can have it.
2. My sig is by far more different, in fact a user in Wikia had a similar situtation.
3. Yes everything I've done is bizzare.
4. I know you don't care on those other Mizu's on twitter and Youtube, however nobody owns a username--Mizu (talk) 18:02, 4 September 2011 (BST)

Okay guys, let's roll it back. The "real" Mizu101 (from Wikia) has never edited on GTW or GTAWiki, either before or after the move/split. This means that no contributions have been wrongly assigned to the "fake" Mizu101, who only registered here in July. Even though the "real" Mizu101 feels that they should be able to use their username on any wiki site, has has shown no intention to edit either GTW/GTAWiki, and as far as I am concerned, there has been no user impersonation.

  • For the "fake" Mizu101 (registered on GTW, with various accounts on Wikia), yes I'm happy to change your username here, but I will only do this once. I have already warned you that you are not permitted to use any multiple accounts, so I hope never to see any. Of course any imersonation of other users is very serious, but I see no evidence of it on this site. (What happens on Wikia is nothing to do with us). That said, we do always have the right to remove you if we feel necessary, but I believe we are much fairer than at Wikia (not lenient, but fair). What would you like your account renaming to?
  • For the "real" Mizu101 (registered on Wikia, but here is User:RealMizu101), I understand your position, but you've never edited on this wiki or the GTA Wiki, so although you possess the account on Wikia, you have no claim to it or any of the edits made by it here. The "fake" Mizu101 has agreed to change his username, so hopefully there will be no issues of 'impersonation' or 'copying' either. You're welcome to edit here, but I'd prefer it if nobody used the Mizu101 username, to avoid any confusion. I am not prepared to rename your account to Mizu101, as all of the edits made on this site under the Mizu101 name were made by the "fake" Mizu101, not you; and that would just make more confusion.
  • Jeff - thanks for the heads-up, but just to point out that this site is not a subsidiary of Wikia, and users on Wikia are not automatically entitled to the same username here. The only exception is where they made edits before the split, which were then imported into GTW under their username, and it's important that those edits as shown as theirs (not an imposters). That does not apply in this situation as Mizu101 never made any edits.

If you have any questions, let me know, but this is NOT the place to discuss the Wikia site, usernames on Wikia, blocks on Wikia or actions by their staff. This is a place to write about GTA games, and anyone who is here solely to disrupt, isn't welcome. gboyers talk 18:20, 4 September 2011 (BST)

I will not waste any more of your time then. I have no intention of editing here. I don't care if my username is changed, but I would prefer Mizu101 to not be used at all. RealMizu101 19:03, 4 September 2011 (BST)
Can you merge this account with my other one User:4th hale, knowing you have the rights.--Mizu (talk) 04:10, 5 September 2011 (BST)

Edit Request

Hey Gboyers,I have noticed that some of the pages (like the Move from Wikia page) have errors or need to be updated, but I cannot edit it. I was wondering if you can please give the inspectors the right to edit all pages on this wiki, except for pages limited to managers and/or executive managers only. --MrLanceVanceDance 10:52, 7 September 2011 (BST)

New Users

Hey Gboyers, I have got a suggestion for you regarding the new users of Grand Theft Wiki. Every time a new user account is created, include the box containing the rules of Grand Theft Wiki on the welcome template that you put on every new user's talk page. That way, you can inform them of the rules before they break them. Thoughts?--MrLanceVanceDance 10:59, 7 September 2011 (BST)

RE: Blocking

I think the blocking system is fine the way it is. I asked that question because I didn't want Grand Theft Wiki to be a harsh wiki at blocking, like what Wikia's GTA Wiki has become. My suggestion is that we should use a three-strike policy against spammers and vandals. So that way, the vandals/spammers have a chance to redeem themselves and actually help our cause, rather than go against us. That will then give us a forgiving and accepting reputation. Also, another thing, are the spammers, by any chance, from the same IP adress or are they completely different people?--MrLanceVanceDance 13:47, 14 September 2011 (BST)

No, I think Grand Theft WIki's blocking policy is fine the way it is and I agree with what you have said. However, are the recent spammers, by any chance, from the same IP adress or are they completely different people?--MrLanceVanceDance 06:55, 16 September 2011 (BST)

Edit summaries

Hey, just wondering if you know why the Edit Summaries on the recent changes page has decided to go missing? I've looked through my preferences but I haven't found anything to make them come back. --Andreaz1 16:42, 16 September 2011 (BST)

They re-appeared again yesterday, massive thanks for the help. (Again...) :) I have to say I don't know many people who listen to and are active within their community as much as you are, huge, massive and all other appropriate adjectives praise for that, thanks! --Andreaz1 20:54, 21 September 2011 (BST)


Why I can't upload an avatar? When I try to, I get this error:

Warning: Missing argument 1 for SpecialUploadAvatar::loadRequest(), called in /home/gtw/public_html/includes/specials/SpecialUpload.php on line 177 and defined in /home/gtw/public_html/extensions/SocialProfile/UserProfile/SpecialUploadAvatar.php on line 35

Fatal error: Call to a member function getUpload() on a non-object in /home/gtw/public_html/includes/upload/UploadFromFile.php on line 21

TheReaperHoldsOurHearts 16:02, 17 September 2011 (BST)


Are you sure we can have him here, he basicly cyber bully anyone.--4th hale (talk) 02:53, 21 September 2011 (BST)

Do keep this is mind that I don't seek out any trouble Gboyers!, since he reported my recent activities, I would like for you to know about his behaviour as so right here, that is all.--4th hale (talk) 19:36, 21 September 2011 (BST)
At this point I have to suggest that it does not appear to me that 4th hale has any intentions of editing this wiki constructively. Although there are a few minor edits in his early history to article trivia sections, he hasn't done any editing besides user talk pages since the beginning of August. His interactions consisted of celebrating some vandalism that User:Tommy-Vercetti did over on wikia, dealing with the whole Mizu101 situation. And - after having been inactive for two weeks - coming straight out of the blue to try and start more trouble with me. And trying to get Gregallz5 started back up.
Before you say it, I agree with you that people should be given a chance to start at a new wiki with a blank slate. And you're free to not care about or even not want to hear about his history on Wikia. But "trying to instigate a fight between two users and/or block-shopping on a user whom he has prior disagreement with" both sound like things that are against the rules here. Specifically, on Grand Theft Wiki:Behaviour, where it says that "hatred campaigns" are specifically not tolerated. Jeff (talk this way) / (stalk this way) 15:37, 22 September 2011 (BST)
Well Greg basicly isn't my conern, in fact I haven't got a clue what he said on my talk page, I'll admit my behaviour has been disruptive and so to McJeff and Gboyers I apologise. 4th hale (talk) 17:39, 22 September 2011 (BST)


In reply to Re: stuff

When I said that I was the most unpopular member of staff I was talking in regards to the user base as a whole, something I think we can both agree on. I don't know why you'd consider me in charge of the files/images, the majority of my edits for them have been in regards to better organising the wiki, something that still needs sorting (although I'm working on it). As for the edit summaries, earlier today Grand Theft AJ said they take three seconds to type, not particularly accurate in my opinion, but taking that figure I'd have spent 25 hours 37 and a half minutes of my life typing edit summaries, time I'd rather spend editing the wiki or doing something else. A-Dust 20:50, 24 September 2011 (BST)


Hi Gboyers. Is this Wiki hosted by a wikifarm? Thanks! Head.Boy.Hog (Talk To Me) 22:47, 25 September 2011 (BST)

Because I really like this Wiki's look. Does it cost you anything to host this Wiki? Head.Boy.Hog (Talk To Me) 12:26, 26 September 2011 (BST)

A Question

Hi, Gboyers, I have a question: What is the + and - in your contributions? GTAjaxoxo (Discuss)

Great News

Gboyers, I went on Wikia and when Wikia said they're making a change eveyone gotten upset and are thinking they might leave Wikia.--4th hale (talk) 02:47, 27 September 2011 (BST)

This, many Wikis really don't like idea of Wikia turning into Facebook so some are considering to leave.--4th hale (talk) 12:08, 27 September 2011 (BST)

Re:Toolbar above editing area and the "Currently editing" toolbar

Is there any way to disable both these features in my preferences? I found very little use for them, yet they manage to disrupt my editing by gobbling up memory and causing wiki pages to freeze. Case in point: As I'm typing this message, the "currently editing" toolbar constantly checks how long it's been since I started editing; the problem is it seems to be incapable of measuring the overall time, and the timer frequently resets when I constantly type for more than 5 seconds, freezing the page momentarily each time. I'm not exactly sure if all those fancy plug-ins in this wiki are useful to other users, but it's certainly more of a hindrance to me. - ZS 18:44, 29 September 2011 (BST)

That's fair enough. The edit toolbar can be disabled in Special:Preferences by unticking "Show edit toolbar" and "Enable enhanced editing toolbar". The currently-editing system isn't working properly, so I've disabled it. Always happy to have feedback, so just let me know if anything else is bugging you or ought to be changed. I've been testing out a fair few fancy plug-ins, some of which have been very useful, some of which just haven't worked out. gboyers talk 18:54, 29 September 2011 (BST)
That's strange. Both those options are already unticked in my preferences, yet the toolbar is still there. Enabling and disabling the options don't work either. Take your time on this though; I'll just check back later tomorrow.

And thanks for the response; I'll keep an eye out for other major problems. - ZS 19:14, 29 September 2011 (BST)

Here are few more problems I've only just recalled:
  • When a navigation box template is used on another navigation box, two [show]/[hide] tags will appear instead of one. You can refer to any vehicle page's navigation box.
  • The "Follow Twitter" link in the lefthand sidebar overlaps the main body of the page, resulting in being unable to select, click, or highlight in that area. I wasn't able to click the save button in the edit page on occasions because it just happened to be in the same row as that link.
Also, the gallery syntax has been acting strangely since yesterday, aligning to the left despite being contained in a centered table (and the "center" alignment intended for the table has now affected the alignment of image captions and the positioning of the thumbnails instead; see the Infernus article as an example). I'm not sure why, but it happened shortly after I highlighted the problems with the editing toolbars yesterday.
You might want to look into those problems when you have the time. - ZS 10:02, 30 September 2011 (BST)

Userbox Help

Hi Gboyers, I've just created a userbox. How do you put your userboxes in the Userbox: Templates ?--GTAjaxoxo (Discuss) 16:13, 1 October 2011 (BST)

I can see you've written the code for your userbox, but not actually created it. Help:Userboxes has the information you need: "You should create your userbox at Template:Userbox:name - this means your box can be included by a user simply using {{userbox:name}}." Then it gives you the code to add to your new userbox's page which will add it to Category:Userboxes. Once you've made it, you can include it in your page using {{userbox:name}} as it says. Let me know if you need any more help. gboyers talk 23:58, 1 October 2011 (BST)

New Haitian Ganglord deletion

Perhaps it would be a good idea if we discussed whether we really need to delete the New Haitian Ganglord article? --MrLanceVanceDance 10:10, 4 October 2011 (BST)

Yep, that's why I proposed deletion rather than just deleting it. I posted my comments on Talk:New Haitian Ganglord. gboyers talk 00:59, 5 October 2011 (BST)


What happened to the medals users used to get when we were on Wikia? Like for 10 edits, you got an award, for 50 edits, you got an award, etc... I thought it was cool but it's just an idea... --Fairnick68 (talk) 20:29, 4 October 2011 (BST)

Here, we don't think that edit count really defines a good editor. For example, some people don't know how to use the "preview" button and press "Publish" 10 times for every edit they make, correcting mistakes, adding more content, fixing layout problems etc (which shows as 10 edits). Whereas other editors make sure the page works properly before saving (which shows as 1 edit). The less experienced editors end up with a much higher edit count than the more-experienced ones, despite often not adding as much useful content. Also, many people contribute behind-the-scenes, making templates and helping organise this wiki, which isn't reflected in the achievement/medal system. So for that reason, I don't believe we should be rewarding or segregating editors based on edit count alone. Doing so would also encourage users to make more high-volume low-quality edits - I've seen this happen in many places (particularly forums which separate users based on post count). We are looking at ways to reward hard-working users, such as our brand-new Main Page "user of the month" segment, and the Grand Theft Wiki: Medals system for the very best and hardest-working editors. If you have any suggestions, I'd love to hear them. gboyers talk 20:38, 4 October 2011 (BST)

Okay, now I understand. I was just thinking the other day that the day I joined, their was a post count on user profiles and a medal system. Thanks for clearing that up. :) --Fairnick68 (talk) 20:50, 4 October 2011 (BST)

User of the Month/Medals

Hey Gboyers, just asking, should the "Users of the month" get a medal? Also, how come there haven't been any medals awarded recently at GTW?--MrLanceVanceDance 13:19, 6 October 2011 (BST)

I think there's a big difference between being a good contributor for a couple of weeks, and performing the type of work required for a medal. The UOTM is designed to encourage people to contribute and to be a reward for users who stand out. Medals are my personal awards to those users who have to a lot more than anyone else over a long period of time to improve this wiki. I've been debating new medal awards recently, but I won't give them out lightly. gboyers talk 13:31, 6 October 2011 (BST)

My articles flagged for deletion

Hey Gboyers, there is something very strange going on at this wiki. My articles "The Businessman's Bodyguard" and "New Haitian Ganglord" have been flagged for deletion, with the reasons being that "these pages will never have any interesting information at all about the character(s) as there is none to be found. It's just retelling what happened in the only mission he/she is featured." However, the Carl Pearson, Mrs. Dawson, Mike Griffin, Dick Tanner, Marcus Hammond, Franco Carter, Nick Kong and Charlie Dilson articles all fall under the same flag (ie. these pages will never have any interesting information at all about the character(s) as there is none to be found. It's just retelling what happened in the only mission he/she is featured.), have less information than the two articles that I have created yet they are not proposed for deletion. Can you please explain why this is the case and is it possible to create a policy regarding this issue to avoid confusion?--MrLanceVanceDance 01:13, 6 October 2011 (BST)

I'm not sure that qualifies as a "very strange thing", it's just that we've reached a point where we need to discuss and decide between two different ways of doing things. I've not read every single page on the wiki, which is why I've only marked for deletion the ones I've read that I think we should consider deleting; and it has nothing to do with who created it.
As I explained, I marked New Haitian Ganglord for deletion as the character is unnamed; not specifically identified as the sole leader of the gang; and not mentioned outside of one mission. The entire information about the character is in the mission page. Now, because the character is unnamed, nobody is going to look up their name and expect to find a page there. The only way people will know about this character is through that single mission, so why not just leave it in the mission page? My point is exemplified by WhatLinksHere - the only pages that link to it are discussion pages. The Haitian Ganglords potentailly qualify as slightly useful as they could be linked to from the Haitians article as well as the mission, but that's all, which is why I suggested having one page about them both.
The other issue was that you had to resort to inventing obvious/redundant content (such as "At some unknown time he joined the Haitian gang") because you realise there isn't enough real information to make a cohesive article. We shouldn't have to do that.
You might argue that the article is "harmless" and there's no point deleting it as it's not as if we pay per-page. I agree to an extent, but if it's a pointless page then it dilutes our other content, fills up categories/lists, and makes extra work when we come to change things (such as replacing/updating infoboxes). I'm happy to keep pages if they're useful, if visitors will want to find them, or if they are needed for other things to make sense. Whether we keep "useless" pages is a decision we could make.
Applying the same logic to the other characters, the same issues arise with unnamed characters (that nobody would look for), and particularly ones that have absolutely no identity or background information whatsoever. Where characters have names or voice actors, then there's straight away a chance that people could be looking those names up to read about them. Where unnamed characters are important to a plotline or a number of missions, then they are useful pages to have, where the information makes a lot more sense to be on that page than spread across lots of other pages (or nowhere at all).
This is a bigger issue than just about those articles, or even about character pages. There have been many discussions on whether to have a page for every shop/business, where they are nothing more than one texture on a wall. For a long time I said this would be better in a table than a page, but it's surprising how much information people can pull out.
Personally, I'm undecided. I don't think we should have dozens of articles about every irrelevant detail or variation. But I think we are big enough to be able to cope with people expanding the wiki like that - so long as it is managed properly. This is something we have done carefully ever since the wiki started - we start off with a small number of high-quality articles, then expand when we're ready. We're ready for a lot more than we used to be, and I don't want this wiki to become stale/empty. That said, I really don't want to end up in a situation where someone goes and makes 1,000 empty stub articles for pointless things (like a page for every grass texture and wheel type); nor where the wiki is so big nobody can use it. Long story short, if there's no content, there should be no page.
As I've said - happy to discuss this to figure out what is in the best interests of this wiki, please don't take it personally at all. gboyers talk 02:22, 6 October 2011 (BST)

Staff Forum

Hey Gboyers, forgive me if this is an inconvinience to you or if I should have already known this but can you tell me how to access the staff forum? Also, can you please tell me how to use it? I have not used forums before.--MrLanceVanceDance 04:27, 7 October 2011 (BST)

Click here and log in with your GTA Place account. Then you can read the topics, reply to topics, and create new topics. gboyers talk 04:36, 7 October 2011 (BST)

Right to Delete Images

Hey Gboyers, I was wondering if it is possible to give inspectors the right to delete images and pages. I am asking this because there are a lot of images in "Category:Delete" that I have tagged for deletion, but still haven't been deleted. After all, Inspectors are supposed to keep the wiki clean and tidy.--MrLanceVanceDance 04:20, 8 October 2011 (BST)

This is something I have considered a few times. Inspectors are intended to be half-staff users who are supposed to look around the wiki, check users edits, identify any problems, and provide a short-term temporary fix for any, until an administrator can come in and perform the necessary blocks/bans/protection/deletion. Inspectors are trusted with the rollback tool, the patrol system, and a shiny badge, to allow them to detect & fix vandalism. In additional, we trust them with the move tool to help them perform no-decision naming fixes (rather than fully merge/delete pages). Their primary role is to patrol, check edits and find problems, rather than to fix problems and deal with problem users.
In contrast, administrators are staff who are trusted to make decisions based on their interpretation of policy - such as deleting pages, blocking users etc. Think of it as the difference between a member of the public who can report a crime to police (and step in if they NEED to, to stop people getting hurt), versus a police officer who has the power to step in, decide what crimes have been committed, and arrest using force. Inspectors are trusted member of public, who go around checking everything, and who are given a couple of tools to help when they're first on scene, but are not expected to do deal with everything themselves.
I don't know if you have PCSOs in Aus, but that's the same principle - PCSOs are always out in the community talking to people, but they don't have many powers, so they are never stuck in the office doing paperwork, the use of powers is left for when the full police officers arrive.
If we gave Inspectors the deletion right too, that would mean they would not spend their time checking edits, but they would be going around dealing with problems, deleting pages, even telling off users or dishing out punishments. That is not their role. It's not because we don't think they're good enough to be administrators, or because we don't trust them with the tools, but it's because we need them to be out checking edits, whilst the role of an administrator is not to check edits but to make the decisions and use their powers to organise the wiki and make big changes. We need both types of people here.
I would be happy for you to have the power of deletion, but ONLY to remove spam pages or completely-obvious pages. I would not want it to be used for anything that should be proposed for deletion or discussed - an administrator needs to make the decision on that. For example, only delete spam, vandalism, and completely irrelevant pages (such as those on which you'd use {{spam}} or {{vandal}}. If there is any question, opinion, or reason why some reasonable people may disagree with the deletion, you should apply the {{delete}} template and let an administrator deal with it. Do you think that is reasonable, and would you like that power on that condition? gboyers talk 12:33, 8 October 2011 (BST)

Sure, that's fine with me, but can you give inspectors the right to delete articles that has been proposed for deletion, but the general public want it deleted (like four or more people want it gone)? Also, can you give inspectors the right to delete unused images taht have been proposed for deletion?--MrLanceVanceDance 01:04, 9 October 2011 (BST)

No. As I said, those are decisions that only administrators should make (for many reasons). Remember that we do NOT make decisions by voting on this site - it is always a staff member that makes the final decision. This is because it is very easy for someone to create 5 accounts and vote 5 times (or get 5 friends to make accounts and vote); and also because the votes of 4 or 5 people are not representative of the 1,160 people who have used GTW over the past year. I've not spoken to other staff members yet, but I would be happy to give Inspectors deletion powers ONLY to be used for spam/vandalism, 100% obvious no-possible-disagreement deletion situations, or where they've checked with an administrator before acting. These powers must NOT be used for situations like proposed deletions, unnecessary/duplicate pages, unused images etc. Any abuse of that right (at all) will result in it being permanently withdrawn or more serious action, as I have to be able to trust all the staff here. Is that understood? gboyers talk 01:24, 9 October 2011 (BST)

Yes, that is understood.--MrLanceVanceDance 04:57, 9 October 2011 (BST)

When I first read this question yesterday, my initial reaction was no - If inspectors (who are often being trialled for administrator) were given deletion rights, then it would need to be harder to become an inspector, which would slow down the entire promotion process and we would end up with less staff. Moving a page to an undesired title doesn't have a big effect, because usually a redirect is created, so the content can still be found. However, deleting a page causes the content to be inaccessible to most users, which (at least until restored) prevents any improvement to the page and ceases discussion.
Although after reading Gboyers' reply, that makes sense. Inspectors should always be trusted users - Who can be trusted not to take an action just because they have the technical ability to do so. This in fact fits part of the inspector's role, which involves checking user edits and reverting (or in this case, deleting) vandalism. So, sounds good to me. JFletcherTalk (formerly User:Biggest gta fan ever) 08:32, 9 October 2011 (BST)


Hey Gboyers, out of curiosity, what is the point of Grand Theft WIki having affiliates?--MrLanceVanceDance 10:49, 9 October 2011 (BST)

Affiliates will be an integral part of the promotion of GTW across other GTA sites, when I have the time to push it (like this). It's just one of many things I've prepared but not started to use yet. gboyers talk 15:35, 9 October 2011 (BST)

I have an idea for Grand Theft Wiki gaining affiliates. We can just affiliate ourselves with all of The GTA Place's affiliates. Once we have affiliated ourselves with The GTA Place's affiliates, we can become affiliates with the affiliates' affiliates. That way, all of the users of the Grand Theft Auto sites we have affiliated ourselves with will find out about Grand Theft Wiki and use this site instead of the site at Wikia. Also, that will popularise this site and hopefully bring it higher up the Google search results.--MrLanceVanceDance 08:48, 11 October 2011 (BST)

That's not an idea, that's how affiliate systems work :p I just haven't had time to do that yet. gboyers talk 12:08, 11 October 2011 (BST)

Diffrence between {{stub}} and {{expand}}.

While I was adding to a few neglected pages, I was adding a the expand note on the top. Is there diffrent situations I should use each in? So do I use {{expand}} on a short artice and {{stub}} on a page that needs more explaining? Sorry to trouble you, but i'm still trying to learn the basics. :) --Fairnick68 (talk) 00:14, 19 October 2011 (BST)

That's a good question. Both template have quite specific intended uses, but are misused a lot on this wiki:
  • {{stub}} is used to mark articles that have only just been started and only have a couple of lines of text on. This should NOT be used where the article is big but needs more content.
  • {{expand}} is used to mark more important articles that are in real need of expansion. This should ONLY be used where you know there is a lot of missing content that should be on that page.
    • Turismo (race) should be marked with {{expand}} because there is quite a lot of content that could be added - such as race maps, screenshots, videos, walkthroughs, glitches/cheats, trivia etc.
    • Learning to Fly should not be marked with {{expand}}, because it's got most of the content expected.
As for breaking my talk page, you can use the <nowiki>code</nowiki> tags to make any {{template code}} not work. I fixed the page for you straight away, but then you edited over it and broke it again. Did you not get an "edit conflict" warning showing you that I'd edited the page since you? No harm done, but always remember to preview! gboyers talk 00:42, 19 October 2011 (BST)

Okay, thanks. By the way, after you edited the page it looked great. I left and came back 1 minute later, and it was broke again, and no one edited it, it was strange. I am very sorry for doing that! I need to remember "Preview" before I save. So sorry!--Fairnick68 (talk) 01:12, 19 October 2011 (BST)

Gallery code change

I'm sure you've noticed the galleries look a lot different than they were since our last discussion here nearly a month ago. For some reason the center tags that were supposed to keep the gallery box centered on a page now no longer do as intended and instead inevitably aligned thumbnail captions to the center. And it started happening very shortly after you disabled the "Currently editing" toolbar back in late-September. Has there been a fundamental change on the wiki's gallery coding? - ZS 21:07, 19 October 2011 (BST)


Hi Gboyers. I don't know if this is against the rules or not, but this guy spammed a talk page in french. He did not use a signature, so I had to look at history. What he wrote on the page is the following (Translate from French to English):

"Hello; His will tell you to go out in rest with me I am in agreement I kiss you returns me by e-mail; Kind regards"

I don't get it, do you? Anyways, here is a link to the talk page Talk:Jennifun. Since he did not contribute anything, I thought it was important for me to report him. I hope I did the right thing.--Fairnick68 (talk) 00:13, 20 October 2011 (BST)

Well spotted, but if you check the page's history, that message was from June 2010, before Grand Theft Wiki left Wikia. That user doesn't exist on this wiki, and hasn't made any edits since the move, so it's not an issue and there's no action we can really take. The message doesn't contain any links or brand names, so it's not a "useful" spam, so there's no need to remove the message or delete the pages it's on. No harm in reporting it though, I encourage you to do so, so thanks! gboyers talk 07:08, 20 October 2011 (BST)

Trouble Ahoy

Hi Gboyers, it's been a while, I've decided to take a break about the you know what, anyway ShoutWiki is going through construction, do you know any other sites where I can create a Wiki?--4th hale (talk) 17:07, 20 October 2011 (BST)

Yes. gboyers talk 18:58, 20 October 2011 (BST)

Bot Usage

Hi. Can you use the bot to replace all

{| align="center" | ... |}


<div style="text-align:center"> ... </div>

According to the w3schools website, the align attribute for tables is deprecated, and the wiki table's align attribute on this website is broken anyways.--spaceeinstein 01:41, 21 October 2011 (BST)

There are better ways of doing it than that. Yes, align=center is old-style HTML and ideally shouldn't be used (but it still pretty much works). the style="text-align:center" is CSS - but the whole point of CSS is that it can be applied to all galleries automatically from a stylesheet rather than having to define it every time. :I've added the neccessary CSS, so now all galleries will be centred just by using <gallery> - no div or table is required. Let me know if that solves your problems. gboyers talk 12:23, 21 October 2011 (BST)

Actually, making galleries centered by default seems to be a bad idea. Not all galleries need to be centered, like in the vehicle image pages (File:Admiral-GTAVC-LooseEnds-front.jpg). I added style="text-align:center" within the galleries tag for the identical effects.--spaceeinstein 16:28, 21 October 2011 (BST)

The old, now broken gallery code is really nothing more than a gallery enveloped in a centered table. The reason I originally introduced that as a gallery standard was because any direct use of the center tag in the gallery syntax also centers thumbnail captions, which are a little harder to read than if they were simply aligned to the left by default. I'll be happy to fix it. - ZS 12:05, 23 October 2011 (BST)
Turns out we can in fact drop the table code and use style="text-align:left" to align thumbnail captions. The problem is this also affects galleries with thumbnails that occupy only one row, as they are aligned to the left in a grid regardless as opposed to independently aligning to the center (see the last two galleries on the Infernus article for examples). - ZS 12:24, 23 October 2011 (BST)
I have edited the Infernus page so that one-row galleries are centered.--spaceeinstein 18:38, 23 October 2011 (BST)

Did you meant to revert revision on common.css and not common.js? My edits on common.js included the fix to the duplicate show/hide text in collapsible tables.--spaceeinstein 18:16, 21 October 2011 (BST)

Yes, you removed all the CSS for navboxes, which (when hard refreshed) broke them completely (they didn't collapse at all). I'll look into it. gboyers talk 19:34, 21 October 2011 (BST)

Ok, so I only removed the duplicate show/hide code and collapsible tables seems to work fine on Google Chrome and Internet Explorer. On Firefox, which I only use to go to this website, I cleared the cache and did a hard refresh and collapsible tables seem to also work correctly.--spaceeinstein 20:29, 21 October 2011 (BST)

Yeah seems to work, I think my browser remembered something from when I was testing the gallery code. I'll re-instate your edit before I reverted it. gboyers talk 20:40, 21 October 2011 (BST)

The GTA Place

I made an account last week, but i'm still "validating". I re-sent the account validation but it never sends me an email. I know I put in the right email when I registered. Any help would be great Gboyers, you know more about this than anyone I can think of. Oh, and by the way, I wasn't born in 1968! It's just an old Gamertag that I had, never left me since, the 68 in my account dosen't mean anything!


--Fairnick68 (talk) 00:11, 22 October 2011 (BST)

I have re-sent your validation email from TGTAP, you ought to receive it now and be able to confirm it. Do you share your email address with someone else, such as a parent (initials R.G.)? If so, I'd suggest you get your own personal email address for this sort of thing. gboyers talk 00:29, 22 October 2011 (BST)

Thats my moms old email, gave it to me six years ago. I have my own email, I just thought that it would make sense to use the same email as I use for GTW. Thanks! Edit: It's still not inside my inbox, I checked my junk mail box also. Do you think that you could send it to my new email? If not, then I will make a new account on TGTAP. --Fairnick68 (talk) 00:38, 22 October 2011 (BST)

Don't post your email address publicly on this site. If you still haven't receive the confirmation email from TGTAP:
  1. Go to Special:Preferences and enter your new personal email, and choose to verify it
  2. Check your email and verify it
  3. Let me know when that's done, then I'll change your email address on TGTAP, and re-send the verification from there
  4. Then you can check your email and verify your TGTAP account.
Then you should have full access to both sites! gboyers talk 00:48, 22 October 2011 (BST)

Where it says password, do I enter my password for GTW or the email password? I just did it by puting in my GTW pass, but it didn't work. So I assume that it is the email password?--Fairnick68 (talk) 00:57, 22 October 2011 (BST)

It asks for your GTW password to confirm that it's you requesting the change (not someone else using your PC). You should never enter your email password on any other website. If you can't remember your password AND you haven't verified your email, I can't help you. gboyers talk 01:02, 22 October 2011 (BST)

Okay, now I got it, it says that it sent it. I'm in my email now, hopefully it works...--Fairnick68 (talk) 01:07, 22 October 2011 (BST)

It ain't working. Sorry to waste your time, thanks anyways. :)--Fairnick68 (talk) 01:11, 22 October 2011 (BST)

Try again in a couple of weeks. I've changed your email address on TGTAP to the one you gave me before, and re-sent the validation email there. gboyers talk 01:20, 22 October 2011 (BST)

It worked! Thanks! I now have an account on TGTAP. Thanks for your help.--Fairnick68 (talk) 02:36, 22 October 2011 (BST)

Category Problem

Hey Gboyers, I think that there is a problem with Category:Pages with broken file links. Some of the pages listed don't have broken file links yet they still appear in the category. Refreshing the page doesn't make any difference.--MrLanceVanceDance 07:14, 24 October 2011 (BST)

You're right. Perhaps some of the pages haven't been purged/edited since the broken-file was uploaded. I've set off a server-side job to refresh ALL links on ALL pages (including categories, whatlinkshere, redlinks etc) which should sort it all out over the next hour or however long it takes. gboyers talk 07:46, 24 October 2011 (BST)

All Fonts

Hey Gboyers, do you know any site that has a list of every fonts like Papyrus, Times New Roman, etc.?--4th hale (talk) 19:50, 24 October 2011 (BST)

There are billions of possible fonts, but it'd only work if you had it installed on your computer. Only these fonts are guaranteed to be on everyone's computers. If you don't mind some people not seeing it, you can use others. gboyers talk 22:49, 24 October 2011 (BST)

Ah, I see, I was curious on what kind of font this is on that image, apparently the user who made that image use a font from Photoshop.--4th hale (talk) 00:25, 25 October 2011 (BST)

Ah okay - well if you make an image, you can use any font on your own computer, doesn't have to be on the viewer's computer. You'd be best asking the author which font he used, or have a look on dafont to see if you can find one you like, download it, install it to your computer, then you can use it in any image you make. gboyers talk 00:30, 25 October 2011 (BST)

Found the font, it seems idiotic that you have to download it, thanks Gboyers.--4th hale (talk) 00:55, 25 October 2011 (BST)


Hi there Gboyers. I want to bring the article Maccer to your attention, because most of the article is copied verbatim from an external website,, which makes it look to me like it violates your Licensing policy. It was that way before the Community Split, for the record. I noticed this on the other wiki and rewrote it there, but I thought that here it would be more prudent to let you know rather than make any sweeping changes to anything, and I could be mistaken about the policy. Jeff (talk this way) / (stalk this way) 04:35, 25 October 2011 (BST)

Content copied from does not violate our licencing policy, as it is considered canonical game content and marketing material; and the article is fully referenced, but thanks for pointing it out. gboyers talk 05:09, 25 October 2011 (BST)


Well it was announced today! But I want to know your opinion on something... The V looks like a $ sign used in the early 1900s, so does that mean it may possibly take place in that time period? I was thinking about adding that to the GTA V article, if it ain't already there... --Fairnick68 (talk) 23:47, 25 October 2011 (BST)

It's already there. gboyers talk 23:48, 25 October 2011 (BST)

Oh, last time I read it was this morning, sorry.--Fairnick68 (talk) 23:50, 25 October 2011 (BST)

Well there's not much chance of a Grand Theft Auto game set in that era, there are virtually no cars, organised crime is limited, and it would just be a Red Dead game. So yeah I wouldn't worry about that! gboyers talk 00:34, 26 October 2011 (BST)

Ha, your right. Im still pretty shocked that they even announced it, I wasn't expecting that untill they were done promoting MP3. They surprised us all. Im kind of disappointed that they never answered the questions for GTA III, as the site may have that teaser all week. But hey, im happy we got an announcment!--Fairnick68 (talk) 00:53, 26 October 2011 (BST)

That teaser is gone alreday and the site works like normal again. The GTA III thing is back as well. --Andreaz1 (talk) 07:47, 26 October 2011 (BST)

Unused Images

Hey Gboyers, is it by any chance possible for you to find these images below a home? Also, if you can't find these images a home, can you please help me delete them please? They seem to be good images but they are not used and don't seem to serve a purpose on this wiki. Thanks.--MrLanceVanceDance (talk) 04:29, 29 October 2011 (BST)

File:Corporal.svg, File:Sergeant.svg, File:Colour Sergeant.png, File:Copyleft.svg, File:Copyright-yellow.svg, File:Question.svg, File:Reupload.PNG, File:Rodrigo X - Social Profile.png, File:GCLogo.png

As I've said before, the purpose of Special:UnusedImages isn't just to find them homes, it's to get rid of unwanted images. I hope you haven't been putting images on pages where they are unnecessary or unsuitable. I'll check those out, and delete any unwanted ones. I know a couple of them will be used but not just yet. I've changed your post above to link to the image instead of displaying them, because displaying them here wrongly removes them from UnusedImages. gboyers talk 18:19, 29 October 2011 (BST)


Yes, I'm still around, I just haven't had much to do around here recently. However, with the GTA V announcement I will certainly be more active. Chimpso (Talk) 00:34, 30 October 2011 (BST)

Badge Question

Hey Gboyers, I have a question, if a user on Wikia achievement boost then does that user derserves a block?--4th hale (talk) 23:51, 31 October 2011 (GMT)

That sentence didn't make sense. If you're asking for my opinion on Wikia matters, that's nothing to do with me. We left that site for a reason, so I'm not going to spend my time fixing problems with that site. If you have a problem with that site, take it to that site's staff or to Wikia. If you must know my personal opinion, if people contribute good content that's great, if they add tons of crap or make dozens of false edits with the intention of increasing edit count, yes that is against our policy (idk about Wikia). gboyers talk 00:39, 1 November 2011 (GMT)

I was only asking your opinion, it's something that a user did and I am fully aware it doesn't concern you but as I said I was asking your opinion on it.--4th hale (talk) 00:47, 1 November 2011 (GMT)


Well, I did say I wanted to return to the discussion table on this. I'll get to it tomorrow. - ZS (talk) 18:11, 2 November 2011 (GMT)

I'll get back to you on the discussion. It'll take some time to respond to. - ZS (talk) 16:52, 5 November 2011 (GMT)

Confirmed Locations of GTA V

Hi Gboyers, apologies for the rather sudden absence, but i'm back. Would it be appropriate if I was to create new articles about the new locations confirmed in GTA V? I have got some relevant information I can include in the articles, but not so much. Should we all maybe wait until further detail is released about the game and it's areas or would it be fine to start the articles without them being seen as pointless. Thanks! -Montario (talk) 21:33, 2 November 2011 (GMT)

There's no rush - it would be silly having dozens of articles saying "Little Seoul is a place seen on a sign in the GTA V trailer" because we can't add anything more except wild speculation. The best thing to do would be to have Los Santos in GTA V and have a list of locations and a general description of the city. A bit like Vehicles in GTA V. --gboyers talk 21:45, 2 November 2011 (GMT)

Grand Theft Mods concern

Hi again, if you look at the recent changes on Grand Theft Mods, people seem to be creating articles which have no reference to the GTA franchise at all, like this, and this. I brought this up, just in case you weren't aware. Thanks--Montario (talk) 11:10, 5 November 2011 (GMT)

Thanks, not checked that in a while, will sort it out! gboyers talk 11:13, 5 November 2011 (GMT)

Female cops?

I have spoken to TheJustinAllenK and we have both wondered where the 'female cops' in the GTA V trailer are? Do we include it on the GTA V page, because neither of us have seen them. Bacon777 (talk) 00:29, 6 November 2011 (GMT)

Look in the History of the page to see who added it, and asked then. If you can't see ANY evidence, then remove it until you find some. I'm sure, if we're wrong, someone will correct it, and you can ask them for proof. Please remember: because someone wrote it on another website does not make it proof. gboyers talk 00:53, 6 November 2011 (GMT)

Red Dead article

I'm fine with it being deleted, but I could not see who did it... Was there any talk about this before it was deleted? Last time I checked, it was the same as it was 2 months ago.--Fairnick68 (talk) 01:14, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

If you visit the page, it tells you who deleted it. Also, at the top of Special:RecentChanges there are links to all the different logs, including the deletion log. No agreement was reached, but I have restored the talk page to allow the discussion to be continued if you wish. gboyers talk 01:38, 11 November 2011 (UTC)